can you start with this book?

[michelej]

Can you start with this book for a 14 year old who is only vaguely familiar with the classical writing process?

[Kathy Weitz]

Michele,

You may be able to start with Diogenes, depending on the skills of your 14 year old, but I would say in general, that unless he has had a great deal of practice with analyzing and imitating great literature and has a strong grammar background that he should begin with Homer. A student of that age should easily be able to complete Homer in one year, following the schedule in the back of the Core Manual. If you choose to use the workbooks, he could complete 2 lessons each week, perhaps skipping some of the lessons that are mostly review of concepts already learned, and doing only one writing project per week.

I highly recommend that he also work through the Poetry lessons, using the schedule in the back of the Poetry Core Manual for older students to complete the book in 12 weeks, or using the workbooks doing 2 lessons per week.

Hope this helps!
Kathy Weitz

[Lene Mahler Jaqua]

I second Kathy's suggestions.

Yes, the average 14 year old can start in CW Diogenes, but unless he has a particularly solid background in classical analysis and imitation, he would be better off starting in CW Homer and doing the CW Poetry for beginners first. You may choose the 12 week older student schedule for CW Poetry, and perhaps jump into CW Homer Workbook B when that comes out, to save time.

HTH, Lene

[Nicole]

I also have a 14 year old. But I also have a 9 year old, too. I'm very confused about how to do classical writing with the two of them, without killing myself! How would you approach this with two who are so far apart in age?

We're relatively new to classical education, and have only just started serious grammar study this past year (older son went to public school through 5th grade, where he had no grammar).

Thanks so much!

[Lene Mahler Jaqua]

9 and 14 is a big age gap as far as how to coordinate the two of them.

But if neither has had any grammar, I would compromise and start them both in CW Aesop and use Workbook B. If you don't want to buy two workbooks, the older can copy the sentences and work on paper as a good solution for an older student.

I would cover the grammar and diagramming and writing projects in Aesop B ...having a daily or every other day teaching session with both together, but letting the older work faster through the book, and then moving the older into CW Homer Workbook A as soon as he has mastered that basic grammar.

It is not so much work having two students in two different levels of CW if you have the Workbooks. The workbooks have all the weekly and daily work laid out so you don't have to plan it. -- You can still keep them together for the teaching sessions, talking to both of them and teaching out of the core book for both of them, first addressing mostly the younger and then mostly the older. (It never hurts a younger student to sit in a bit over his own level. Most younger students pick up so much through that "no pressure" teaching situation).

Your older student, ideally would get through the Homer A and B workbooks (which is most of the grammar he needs to learn) in a year's time and will then be ready for CW Diogenes.

Does this answer your question?

Lene

[Nicole]

Thank you, yes. This does answer my question.

My older son is just finishing the Rod & Staff grade 6 grammar text. The material has not been so difficult, but this is a new way of thinking for him. My younger son is still at the beginning of his grammar text (grade 3, also R & S) but is a bit more obsteperous about doing his work. So we're progressing slowly through the book. However, he listens in on his brother's grammar lessons, and often pipes up with the correct answer, sometimes from another room in the house, correcting his brother! So, yes, again, I've seen the indirect method of teaching in action!

But I do have one last question.... Would both boys be using the same Harvey's text, or would I want the more advanced book for the older child? I read in another post that there are two levels of Harvey.

Again, thank you!

[Lene Mahler Jaqua]

Given that your oldest is in 6th grade, I would keep both of them in the Elementary for now. The Revised Harvey's is for 7 - 9th grade ideally.

Lene

[Nicole]

Oh, sorry. One last question....

Could we start with the poetry? Since it's a shorter program, and it's so late in the year, I thought we could test the water this summer with that, then move on next fall to Aesop. Would that work?

And I should have been more clear about the fact that we're using the 6th grade text only because my son didn't have a strong grammar background -- he's actually in 8th grade in all other subjects. Just don't want to misrepresent the poor guy!

Again thank you.

[Lene Mahler Jaqua]

Yes, Poetry can stand alone. It's a fun program, lots of different type of writing. You can do that all year, if you like too. We just spread it out in our recommendations because people like a pre-packaged program that is laid out, but you can juggle in poetry any time you like.

Lene